From: "Geoffrey Robert Mason" <[j r m] at [grove.ufl.edu]>
Subject: INTERVIEW: Colleen Doran
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 15:30:51 -0500 (EST)

Colleen Doran talks about 'A Distant Soil'
by Jeff Mason, editor of Indy magazine

February 24, 1995

This interview first appeared, in part, in Comics Buyer's Guide #1111,
March 3, 1995.

Throughout Colleen Doran's career as a professional comic book artist,
she has worked on such notable projects as Sandman, Anne Rice's:
The Master of Rampling Gate, and Valor.  During this time, she has
been working on her most personal project, A Distant Soil, which she
now self-publishes.  Over the years of A Distant Soil's unfolding,
many questions have been raised.  A recent survey of internet users
produced quite a number of interesting questions for Colleen Doran to
field.

Jeff Mason:  What are the influences behind A Distant Soil?  I notice
you've been doing this story for almost ten years now -- had you
written it even earlier?

Colleen Doran:  A Distant Soil is different from the earlier editions
because I was quite dissatisfied with the editorial direction on the
earlier editions of the series and so, when I finally achieved a little
more creative autonomy, I completely rewrote and redrew all of the
earlier material.  Not a single page remains from the Warp edition.
For the details of the difficulties, you're welcome to refer to The
Comics Journal #108 and #115.  I have no real interest in dissecting
the corpse that was the old Warp Graphics, and I do not care to discuss
any of the details any longer.  It's a painful and ugly story that has
never been fully revealed but it is in the past and I am going to leave it
there.

Mason:  Will A Distant Soil be coming out on a more regular schedule
anytime?  What kind of schedule do you plan for the next couple of
years?

Doran:  A Distant Soil will be out monthly through issue #12 and will
be bimonthly thereafter.

Mason:  How is A Distant Soil doing circulation wise?

Doran:  Pretty good.  A Distant Soil #1 3rd printing is sold out which
brings the circulation to 16,000.  Our fourth printing which we will
print in January '95, will bring us to 20,000.  When our initial orders
reach 16,000, I'll be dancing in the streets, but right now, we only
reach those numbers through reorders.  My distributor orders have
increased 20% between #9 and #10 so we may get to that point sooner
than I'd hoped!  Orders on #12 are up 23% which is fairly amazing.

Mason:  Are there plans to do a graphic novel compilation of any of
the current series?

Doran:  Eventually, but not for at least a year and a half.

Mason:  Jo Duffy went ballistic at Brian Douglas Ahern's Bumpkin
Buzz cartoon in CBG that complained that Doran's Valor was more
effeminate that he should be.  What was your reaction to the cartoon?

Doran:  I will say this:  three months after the strip was published
(which, I must add I've never seen because I do not subscribe to the
Comics Buyer's Guide), this Ahern person wrote a lengthy letter in
which he angrily defended himself against his critics.  He contended
that the story was not, in fact about Valor, or me, at all.

My Problem is this; knowing that my name was being bandied about
as the subject of his little barb, why, or why, did it take Mr. Sensitive
three solid months to come forward to say otherwise?  Nice for him to
consider my feelings, no?

At least the controversy got his strip noticed.  I hope he feels good
about that.

Mason:  You seem to have hinted that some of the characters in A
Distant Soil are gay (e.g., Rieken/Seren, D'mer, maybe Jason also).  Is
this accurate?  Is it significant or just incidental?  Do you plan to
explore this or reveal more in later issues?

Doran:  I didn't hint.  I thought I was pretty obvious.  Rieken and
D'mer are lovers and bisexual.  Jason is not gay.  I do plan to explore
gay rights concerns at greater length in the future.  Gay rights are
human rights and I don't care if people think I'm a lesbian.  Just shows
how homophobic they are.  Like straight people can't support gay
rights!  That's like saying men can't be feminists!  Really stupid.

I've gotten a couple of nasty grams from fans about it, most notably
from a perennial fan loony who is always writing something wacky.
he complained about "the graphic hand holding" (woo woo, mustn't
hold hands, might get cooties!) and the "homosexuality and
lesbianism".  I refuse to argue with anyone who is too stupid not to
know that lesbians are homosexuals.

Most fans are pretty cool about it, though.

Since Christian theology is a major subject of study for me, I intend to
address those issues also.  Galahad, for example, will have to have
read the Bible in the early Greek.  There are no admonitions against
homosexuals in the original texts.  I imagine I will piss off the
religious radical right but I also refuse to argue with anyone who holds
the King James version as the word of God.  If it's the word of God,
why is it the King James VERSION???  It diverges radically from the
early texts.

O boy, I just read the last paragraphs.  No, Galahad isn't gay.

Mason:  A member of the A Distant Soil fan club has mentioned to me
that they haven't received their T-shirt nor any of the newsletters.
What is the situation with the fan club?

Doran:  Hmmm.  Bummer.  T-shirts have been sent.  I just finished
another newsletter.  Have his people write my people and we'll track
down the problem.  A couple of months ago, our processor memory
was wiped out and we got waaaaayyyy behind on correspondence, but
be patient and we'll take care of it.

The whole story about the fan club is kind of lengthy, but the gist of it
is that the fan club was originally being run by a couple of women who
asked if they could and would I endorse it.  I thought it was a nice
idea, so I said sure.

While I'm sure they had the best of intentions, things went sour when a
couple of members got in to an argument.  Two people who were
helping run the club gossiped about a third party and personal
information quite literally got spread all over the country.  The
unfortunate victim of the gossip had some pretty sensitive personal
information revealed to total strangers and her feelings were really
hurt, especially when people she didn't know were calling up from
halfway across the world asking lots of personal questions.  It was a
mess.

At one point things got kind of ugly.  Since I wasn't directly involved
in running the club, (I just endorsed it and supplied information and
club goodies, I didn't derive any income from it) I didn't find out about
things until things had gotten bad enough that people started talking
"lawsuit".  I spoke to one of the people running the club and she was
so angry that I had the temerity to point out that gossip is hurtful and
maybe they'd better rethink their club policies, that she quit on the spot
and she said she'd disband the club.  I said fine, so are you going to
refund all the money?  And she said, "Duhhhhh...".

I told her I'd be happy to take over club operations, just send me the
records, the club funds and the financial statements.  When they
finally showed up, I learned to my dismay that there was not only NO
money left, the club was badly in debt (four figures worth) and that
they'd already promised membership renewal goodies to people,
collected money and spent it.  It was a disaster.

I had to cover the loss myself and restructure the club, which I've done.
We sent out the T-shirts and the other goodies and we are back on
track.  As of July 5, 1994, we're now in the black.  So, that's what
happened with the club.  As I said, I really think the people running
the club were very nice, but absolutely clueless as to how to run a
business, even a small one.  They had no business license and no tax
exemption for a non-profit organization.  They had no protection if the
woman who had been upset by what had happened had decided to sue.
It could have gone really badly for them.

I should have been a lot more careful about endorsing the club.  I take
full responsibility.  I really had no way of knowing who they were or
what kind of people they were; I just tend to think of fans as nice
people, and didn't anticipate liability problems.  Neil Gaiman called
me to ask about a club some fans were thinking of starting for him and
I had to advise him to keep his distance.  You know, you don't really
know these people.  Be careful.  It's a shame, but it's the way it is.

Fortunately, the woman who was the victim of the gossip is okay with
what happened now, but the people who used to run the club are
resentful that they don't run it any more, which is just too bad.

So now your friend knows why we had a big delay.  If he hasn't gotten
his stuff, he really should write us.  I can't read minds and I'm not on
the Internet.  If anyone has a problem, get in touch and we'll take care
of it.

Mason:  How do you feel about the Capital City cancellation policy?

Doran:  My principal objections concern the failure of the distributors
to notify us in a timely enough fashion so that the publishers could
reschedule or reimplement their operations to accommodate the new
policies.  I would appreciate it if Capital's policy allowed for a
cancellation grace period.  Say, you could cancel thirty days before
shipment without penalty.  I think that would enable retailers to retool
their finances.  Maybe I'm wrong.  I think Capital should explore the
option.  I do wish the distributors would go to a 60 day policy.  I tell
you, within five days of shipping, you get a distributor late notice!
Overall, all of the distributors have been very tolerant of our shipping
schedule.

Of course, after spending more time with retailers at the last two trade
shows, I understand a lot better how important it is for books to ship on
time.  I never really gave it much thought before.  I know that when A
Distant Soil doesn't ship on time, no one is going to go out of business,
but I really am being selfish if I think I can do business with that
attitude.  The retailers can't rely on income from my book unless they
can rely on the book showing up and they will place their orders
accordingly.  Over the last few months, we've really increased our
shipping efficiency and it has begun paying off in higher orders.  I'm
going to do everything in my power to continually improve our record.
It will not improve radically until our orders improve radically.  Catch
22.  Fortunately, our back issue sales have dramatically increased (I
mean BIG TIME!!!  We'll be going into the 4th printing of #1 by
January), and that has increased our cash flow.

Mason:  What do you think of the future of self-publishing in the
comic industry?  Will there be a resurgence of the independent
publishers due to the exodus of creators from the major companies?

Doran:  Yes, there will be a surge in the independent press.  There will
be a self-publisher boom and bust, but it won't be anything like the
black and white boom and bust of the mid 1980's.  Retailers are too
cautious these days.  Fact is, comic book speculation is REALLY
DUMB.  No one can predict the appeal of a Bone.  Forget it.  Get over
it.  I think Steve Bissette's Tyrant could be very hot, but you never
know!  It does look like an awesome piece of work.

However, even with Jo Duffy on Nestrobber, retailers are really
cautious with their orders and Jo Duffy is a hot creator!  It's wacky.  A
lot of good stuff could die off, but retailers don't want to get burned.
Vicious cycle.  Any creator who cannot take a loss on the first few
issues of a book cannot expect self-publishing success.  Most creators
can't afford to lose that kind of money.  A Distant Soil is profitable
now, and it sold 8,000 in the first printing, but start up costs killed my
profits and there wasn't any money left to print #2!  Wah!  If a creator
can last beyond issue #5, they should be okay.

Independent publishers are going to whittle away at the market share
of the big two and comic publishers won't be able to afford personal
boxes at the ball game anymore.  Oh woe.  Oh, beg your pardon, I'm
thinking about First Comics.  Now we know why they're out of
business!

The economic approach of the comic book upper echelon paper
pushers is the economics of scarcity, a belief that the market is limited
and there is only so much money to go around and whoever dies with
the most market share wins.

Whoever dies with the most market share is still dead.

I contend that the market will continue to experience a slow, but steady
expansion with predictable, but painful, periodic adjustments that will
result in some people going out of business and some people getting
fat feeding off the carcasses of the dead.  I do believe that within the
next decade, but toward the latter part of it, there will be a massive and
explosive expansion that will be the direct result of constant, never-
before-seen influx of popular and successful comics oriented material
in the mainstream.  Comic books will become a more acceptable form
of mainstream entertainment, primarily because comic books will
make the suits a lot of money.  In the interests of making more money,
conglomerates like Disney and Warner will expend greater resources
in creating consumer demand for the comic book medium.  This will
inure to the benefit of all publishers, creators and retailers, even our
dear Fantagraphics.  For while the Fantagraphics boys will continue to
lament the lamentable state of pop culture pulp junk, there will always
be a small percentage of that new audience which will be looking for
the new and radical fringe faction comics fix, and they'll find books to
their taste.  If the ranks of Fantagraphics readership increases by even
a few thousand, and it will, the bad boys can lament our medium all
the way to the bank.  The great thing about being small press is that
the low overhead makes publishing incredibly cheap and even an
increase of only a thousand readers, a pittance to a company like
Marvel, is practically a windfall to a small publisher.  Thus, junk will
thrive, but art will live also.

Mason:  How do you see the lack of women writers and artists
affecting the output and attitude of the comic book industry, and how
do you see the output and attitude of the comic book industry affecting
female creators and fans?

Doran:  Oh, God, the girl, question.  I hate the girl question.  I'm not
going to answer this.

Mason:  How it was that you came to draw "Death" as a young 1940's
woman among Holocaust victims in "The Death Gallery?"

Doran:  Neil Gaiman one told me that many of his relatives had died in
the Holocaust.  Since military history is a family hobby, when we went
to London last year, we spent a lot of time at the Imperial War
Museum where they have an extensive Belsen exhibit.  The Holocaust
is, to me, the most interesting feature of World War II and I had just
read an article where the commentator noted that when viewing
evidence of the Holocaust, it was important NOT to look away.  So I
was determined to see the entire exhibit which took over an hour.

The part that got me the most was the taped accounts of survivors who
spoke about their experiences which you listened to through little
phones while watching movies of the atrocities and the aftermath.  I
remember one woman the most, who had been a little girl at the time
as she spoke about how the Americans liberated the Jews.  The sad,
sad thing was that so many died of shock and disease AFTER the
liberation, and this woman was afraid she would die in the hospital.
But an American soldier took pity on her and gave her special
attention and care.  She spoke about the moment when she knew she
wasn't going to die and only then did she start to cry.  The movies
showed the pathetic people, just wasted to sticks not even able to sit
up, being washed with hoses and their faces so blank.  They didn't
even look sad, just empty.

When I got back I bought Shoah on video, which is a massive
documentary of the Holocaust and about a week later, DC called me
with the Death Gallery assignment.  I knew exactly what I wanted to
do.  I tried to suggest the variety of victims of the Holocaust in the
background of the picture, but I don't know if I succeeded.  There were
about three hundred camps, which is a horrifying thought, and all non-
Aryans were targeted.  Apparently, black P.O.W.'s got the treatment as
well as Catholics, homosexuals, artists and intellectuals and many
Russians and Poles who were non-Jews.

One of the most inspiring stories of the War to me is the escape from
Sobibor.  It was the only successful large scale prison camp escape.
The camp was closed after the break and I believe that a large part of
the success of the break was due to the Russian soldiers who were also
prisoners in the camp.  So many of the civilians had had their ability to
stand up for themselves destroyed over years of systematic abuse.
Most of the camp prisoners had learned to be helpless and couldn't
stand up and fight at all.  The way the Nazi's were able to round up and
make thousands of prisoners fear a few hundred soldiers is terrifying
in so many ways.  I like to think I would fight back.  Don't you wonder
if you've got what it takes to be like those brave people who stood up
and fought back?

There are so many holocausts throughout history.  I've been reading in
the Washington Post that the estimates are that Mao Tse Tung and his
policies may have wiped out as many as 60 million Chinese, some
through assassination, others, the majority, peasants who died from
starvation, the direct result of his inflexible industrial and economic
policies.  That a few thousand can terrorize millions into such a level
of subservience and helplessness is the scariest thing I can think of.
Who needs monsters when we've got human beings?

That's why I did the picture.

Mason:  What did you think of Richard Pini's letter in Wizard?

Doran:  If Richard Pini had created A Distant Soil and if Warp
Graphics did, in fact, have a legitimate claim to the book, I wouldn't be
the sole owner, the sole creator, and the self publisher of A Distant
Soil today.

Mason:  Can you tell us what went on at Warp Graphics?

Doran:  I don't want to get into the gory details of what happened at
Warp because my contract forbids me to do so and it's an unpleasant
tale.  I cannot directly challenge Warp's allegations about my contract
outside a court of law because I can't afford a lawsuit.  It's that simple.
If I breach confidentiality, Warp can easily afford to hit me with a suit
with the $elf-millions$, but I don't have that option, so I'll just let it go.
I just refer people back to The Comics Journal #108 and #115 and tell
them to make up their own mind.

For your information:
A Distant Soil is carried by all of the major comic book distributors,
but can be ordered directly from Aria Press.  An eight issue
subscription is $12.50 ($14.50 for Canada and Mexico, $20.00
overseas).  A Distant Soil: Immigrant Song, $8.00.  Aria Press, 12638-
28 Jefferson Ave, Suite 173, Newport News, VA  23602.


Geoffrey R. Mason                 |     [j r m] at [grove.ufl.edu]
Editor - Indy Magazine            |     611 Northwest 34th Drive
College of Law - Univ of Florida  |     Gainesville, Florida 32607-2429

------------------------------

End of COMICS-L Digest - 22 Feb 1995 to 24 Feb 1995 - Special issue
*******************************************************************